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PostPosted: Tue Dec 21, 2010 9:52 am 
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We Had A Auction in October, Selling the Contents of A Large Building, More Furniture than You would Normally See at Auction. In My Ads, Also in My Announcements, I Stated that The State was Taking over the Building For A Highway Project Going on in Front of the Building, And Everything had to Be Removed by the Following Day.
A Man Showed up,Late in the Auction, I Know this Man as a Antique Dealer Who is Known to Buy Items at Auction, And then Pick the Items up When it is Convienant For Him,So I announced Again, Removal by the Next Day. He bought 1 Cabinet, And Paid, And Left. My Daughter -in- Law is the Cashier, I asked Her if He said Anything about Picking up the Cabinet, She Said No one Said anything About Coming Back, As Most People were Loading That Day. I came Back The next Day To let People in, I was Busy all Day There Myself , People in and out all Day Loading, He never Showed Up, But when I left, The Cabinet was Not there, The Builkding Was Empty. I assumed He Sent Someone in to Pick it Up. A week Later He calls Me to Make Arrangements to Get in the Building to Get his Cabinet.
I told him the Building Was Empty,When I left. We talked About the Ads, And Announcements Made, He Said He Travels all Around The State, And Buys and picks up Later,When He Wants To. He told Me, I never said anything or Made Any Announcements,And Said I should Had Moved his Cabinet Back to My Auction House untill he Wanted to Come Get it. I told Him it was advertised that it needed to be Removed the Next Day, He said He Didnt see the Ad, A friend Called Him about the Auction, Then Changed his Story saying He was driving by and saw the Signs.
Now he has Filed a Complaint with the Attorney Generals office, Basically Because I didnt Cater to Him and Protect his cabinet for Him. I've Never had this happen befoore in the 24 years I've been A Auctioneer.In the Complaint He Said He asked the Cashier about Coming Back another day and Picking it up, which is not True, She Knew Everything had to be Out of the Building.
Any Thoughts on This, or has Anyone had anything like This Happen to Them?I told Him once We Say Sold, It Changes Ownership, and He is Responsible for the Item at That Point.
Sorry for the Long Post, Just needed to Rant!

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John D. Adams-Auctioneer
Jersey County Auction
Kane,Illinois
http://WWW.JERSEYCOUNTYAUCTIONS.COM


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 21, 2010 10:48 am 
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Location: Adrian, Mi.
Tell him to go suck an egg. You are not his babysitter, nor a caretaker for his purchases.

Sorry, but people like that just annoy the hell out of me. You probably couldn't tell!

Do you have any terms of sale printed on your bid cards? I do not, but I have seen them and it might not be a bad idea.

Did you happen to record this auction or at least the portion where you give out the terms and conditions?

Never the less, this guy knows better. Tell him I said so! ;)

Lyn Liechty, Auctioneer
http://www.arealauction.com


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 21, 2010 11:06 am 
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I announce and have it in my terms & conditions that when I say sold title transfers at that time and you own it. Neither the auction company nor the consignor will be responsible for damaged or missing items.
I had a contract where I sold vehicles & heavy equipment on a regular basis. I had several people who take their time removing their purchases until I created a two part set of terms & conditions for the bidder to sign. They got a copy and I kept the original. In the conditions I put any item left after a certain date was going to be charged $20.00 per day storage and any item left after a later date will be considered abandoned and all proceeds forfeit. I stuck to my terms and when one of the problem bidders tried to make a fuss I asked for his lawyer and faxed a copy of the terms he signed. That was 4 years ago he still comes to my auctions and removes his items quickly.

Chuck

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North Pacific Auctioneers
Estates, Industrial, Guns, Business Liquidations
http://www.northpacificauctions.com
Anchorage, Alaska


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 21, 2010 11:28 am 
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Location: Adrian, Mi.
Sounds like a good way to handle it.

I do have signs posted in my building that anything not picked up within seven days will be considered to be abandoned property and dealt with accordingly.

Lyn Liechty, Auctioneer
http://www.arealauction.com


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 21, 2010 12:42 pm 
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Location: Houston TX
Signs and announcements are always good reminders... to those that pay attention.

I hate to say it, but the days of agreements based on your word or a handshake are about over.
The lawyers have seen to that and it's hard enough to prove the intentions of a written contract, without them trying to find the loopholes.

However, the only way to properly protect yourself and lay out the terms of the contractual obligations of the bidders (or sellers) is by a written contract and in the case of the buyers, that would be the Terms and Conditions. Of course, just having a written terms and conditions is only one step, as you also need to have their signature showing that they agreed to the contract.

Despite the age-old laws of auctions, which state that the auctioneers verbal terms apply whether you heard them or not, such verbal agreements come down to "understanding" and it becomes difficult to prove that both sides had a "meeting of the minds" and had the same understanding. Then you may have to find witnesses that will provide credible evidence to show that a reasonable person would have drawn the same conclusion. This is where the announcements before or during an auction can often be a matter of interpretation and left to the judgment of a court. In such cases, it still comes down to "he said, she said" and how well the witnesses recount the actual wording or if their own account may be called into question.

This is why I've stated on many occasions, an auctioneer should always have a written Terms and Conditions. In addition, each registrant should complete and sign a registration form at each auction and the form should include a statement indicating that the bidder's agreement to having read and understands the Terms and Conditions for that particular auction. So, even those that arrive after the opening statements can't say they didn't know and regardless of how auction laws read, it helps to put the full burden of proof upon the buyer.

My Terms and Conditions for most auctions are two pages long and attempt to cover just about everything that could be called into question. Everyone always fills out a registration form, signs and dates it, which indicates a statement indicating they have read and their agreement to the terms. While this does not cover every detail for every item sold, as we may add or modify particular terms for a particular item during the course of the auction, it does cover the majority of terms. Recording the auction helps to provide details of those minor changes or other details that may occur during the sale.

Jim Ford
Professional Auctioneer & Auction Marketing for the 21st Century

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Texas-National Auctioneers
Professional Auction Services for Houston & the Great State of Texas
Personal Estate - Business Liquidation - Real Estate - Charity Fundraisers

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Last edited by James Ford on Tue Dec 21, 2010 1:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 21, 2010 12:53 pm 
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Location: Lake Placid,Fl.
John sounds like you did fine job. The problem is we have Attorney Generals, Judges and other government officials that do not use common sense and take these frivolous complaints. Hope everything turns out well for you. Please keep us posted.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 21, 2010 2:52 pm 
Our policy is the same as Lyn's. In fact, it is even printed on the bid cards and states that use of the bid card to buy constitutes acceptance of the terms. I know that a lot of auctioneers use hand written bid numbers. We found it convenient and cost effective to have them printed professionally. We do occasionally have to discard items not picked up within 7 days. If the policy is in writing with proof that they buyer has agreed to it, there's not much that a court can do to side with the buyer.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 21, 2010 11:31 pm 
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I guess Luckily, It was Only $210.00. This Would Be a Small Claims Case If He Pursues It. In This Instance, I will Fight Him All the Way. This Is the First Auction He has Attended Of Mine, In a Year Or More, He Knew The Rules, But The Arrogance Runs Wild When He walks In, He is Better Than You, He does know it All....Just Ask Him, He'll Tell You So.But Rules Don't Apply to Him.

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John D. Adams-Auctioneer
Jersey County Auction
Kane,Illinois
http://WWW.JERSEYCOUNTYAUCTIONS.COM


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 8:21 am 
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An Update.... He also Reported Me to The Illinois Department of Financial And Professional Regulation, Who We are Licensed Through. The Investigator Called Me Yesterday, And Had Looked Over His Complaint, And My Response to the Complaint, Along With a Copy of My Advertisement, Stating Removal Terms. He Said He had A phone Conversation with The Man Telling Him A Auctioneer is Not A Storage Warehouse, And I am Not Responsible for the Care of the Item, once The item is Sold.
The Investigator Said The Man Was not Happy with this Response, And told Me That The Buyer Pretty Much Stated, He wasn't Done With Me Yet, Small Claims Court is Next.
What Some People will Do, If They Don't Get Their Way!

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John D. Adams-Auctioneer
Jersey County Auction
Kane,Illinois
http://WWW.JERSEYCOUNTYAUCTIONS.COM


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 9:35 am 
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Location: Adrian, Mi.
I hope you don't plan on ever allowing this idiot to attend another of your auctions. I also would not lose any sleep if every auctioneer in your area banned this clown from attending any of their auctions.

With his arrogance, he reminds me of the fly who was sitting on the back of a wagon going down a dirt road. As he sat there and watched the dust fly up, he stuck his little chest out and said; "My, oh my. I sure must be important. Just look at all the dust I am stirring up!"

Lyn Liechty, Auctioneer
http://www.arealauction.com


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